Don't listen to fools!

Nadezhda Makarenko, "SIA-PRESS" 

Times are hard these days. The dissertations of some deputies and ministers turn out to be by no means slightly written off. Ignorant people are sculpting laws in the State Duma. In the meantime, the country is offering to revive science, but scientists believe that, in general, there is nothing. The correspondent of the "New City" talked with the famous Russian bioinformatician Mikhail Gelfand – a man of principle, intelligent, sober-minded and not afraid to voice his opinion. He told what he thinks about the Soviet Union, how to popularize science, which of the Surgut scientists is proficient and how absurd is the ban on GMOs and everything that begins with E. 

Photo by Anna Urmantseva

– How would you describe the situation with science in Russia now?..

– As well as the situation with everything else – healthcare, education, economy, law enforcement system – as very bad. There is no specifics in science.

– They often say: "And it was better in the USSR"…

– The USSR was a disgusting state, thoroughly hypocritical. And it was very disgusting to live in it. There was nothing better in the USSR. And science, too.

– You are engaged in bioinformatics yourself. Tell us briefly for ordinary people what kind of animal this is and what scientific prospects this area has. 

– Bioinformatics is a way of doing biology, consisting in the fact that we analyze mass data obtained not in individual experiments, when one particular gene or protein is studied, but in mass experiments, when the work of all genes at once or the interaction of all proteins at once, or the whole genome is studied. It turns out that at the same time it is possible to answer two types of reasonable biological questions: both traditional ones, for example, about the functions of specific proteins or about the regulation of the work of specific genes, and completely new questions that were previously impossible to ask, describing the life of the cell as a whole. What, for example, is the difference between the work of all genes in healthy tissues and in cancer? 

By and large, this is a set of techniques. It cannot be said that this is an independent science. This, like microscopy, is not a science, but rather a technical means. But it turns out that in this way you can do a lot of different interesting biology. And if we talk about fundamental bioinformatics, about science with a capital letter, then it studies molecular evolution: how it all turned out, how it develops, how random mutations occur, how selection then affects them. 

It can be noticed that the fund's support groups are still functioning on social networks. Have the passions for the "Dynasty" already subsided? 

– I don't know what exactly you mean by the passion for the "Dynasty", but I would say a gross mistake was made, or rather, very wrong, proceeding from idiotic premises, conscious actions. The "dynasty" as such is no longer there, and therefore the passions have subsided, because how much can you cry over a corpse? Another thing is that people who were engaged in enlightenment are not going to give up this business. Now various forms of self-organization of the educational community are being actively discussed. 

– Now there are various educational projects containing popular science lectures. Well, for example, "Gutenberg's Smoking Room". How to make such projects become more?

– Two ways. The most important thing is not to interfere. When this wisdom is successfully learned, then you can already help. If the state had a system of expertise, if the state had a corresponding goal, then it would be quite possible to select some educational projects, help them with small funding. Due to this, it would be possible to make it all more interesting, because good popularization is not cheap: it is necessary to show experiments, make films and videos. In fact, there are funds for this. They are allocated by the Ministry of Education and Science, they just end up in some strange places. Not the ones you mentioned.

– Speaking of lectures. We also decided to do a good deed and hold popular science lectures. They called a serious scientist, the director of the Institute of Natural and Technical Sciences. And in the middle of the lecture he takes and says that the theory of evolution has no evidence…

– What kind of organization is this Institute of Natural and Technical Sciences?

– This is with us (in Surgut – VM) at the university. 

– Well, then, hello to your university! 

– That's how to be here? Is it possible to say that the quality of science in the regions is worse?

– It's different in different regions. I understand that you had Science Festivals that were held with the support of the "Dynasty"?

– Yes, once, as far as I know, it was definitely carried out. 

Is it wrong?

– In capitals, in general, all people are more free in their reasoning. This has a lot to do with it. There is a little more freedom of choice in the capital. If, for example, there is one institute in the city, most likely, you will not fight much with its director. And in those places where there is a choice, there is always an opportunity to move to another place or find another occupation. This is one side. And the second side concerns the fact that people in the capital are, in principle, more free-thinking. This is shown by the results of elections and various polls. But it's better to ask sociologists, of course.

Now, as we are informed, GMOs will not be used in agriculture in our country. Can you explain to our readers what follows from this?

– This is some kind of fool from the LDPR, who seems to be an accountant by profession. I think this is senseless populism. Unfortunately, the State Duma is already discussing a bill banning the cultivation of genetically modified varieties in Russia. And this is an extremely harmful bill from the state point of view, but it has already been adopted in the first reading. And now the scientific community is discussing whether there is a chance to correct it so that it is not catastrophic, but at least just bad. I think that it should simply be withdrawn, but most colleagues think that it is politically unworkable, and we should try to correct it. 

And as for this very illiterate aunt, she wants to ban all supplements that start with E. So, there is such a food additive – malonate, aka preservative E296. If she forbids it, then all apples should be banned, because another name for this preservative is malic acid. 

It is contained in apples. Apples also contain: acidity regulators E300 – ascorbic acid, E330 –citric acid, E334 – tartaric acid, succinic acid – E363, five different dyes (also all on E), four preservatives, including malonate, emulsifier pectin, flavor enhancer E620 – glutamic acid and much more… And all this in a normal apple, plucked from a tree in grandma's garden! I'm just wondering how this lovely lady is going to ban apples. 

– It's like with that story when they wanted to ban dihydrogen monoxide as something very harmful, but it turned out that it was water…

– Well, she's a fool! I'm sorry, but this is actually a systemic problem, not necessarily related to the LDPR party. The problem is that in our country, people who are unfit for this business due to stupidity and illiteracy are engaged in legislative activity.

– Do you, as a scientist, feel the problem of distortion of scientific facts by the media? It is not uncommon to hear how journalists misrepresent the facts: either they invented a cure for cancer, or suddenly a myth appeared on the web that the body does not need salt. 

– There are different kinds of distortions. They happen because of excessive enthusiasm: when quite reasonable progress has been achieved, and it is served as a sensation, as if everything has been cured. Or there are distortions and factual errors from illiteracy. There is pseudoscience, all sorts of psychics, extraterrestrial aliens and astrological predictions. But good journalists, as a rule, do not distort. But the bad ones are. There is no scientific specificity here. 

– How to contribute to the fact that there are fewer distortions? Conduct educational activities?

– You see, the level of journalism in principle has dropped a lot, because there is a selection based on negative qualities, first of all, on the ability to lie. When a person lies about elections, he will lie about science in the same way, because there are no professional criteria and the concept of professional reputation. To write with your left foot and quickly shove something somewhere is not a shame. Because if it's not a shame to lie, then it's even more so to hack.

You are a member of the expert council of the Houdini Prize, the creators of which promise a million to anyone who proves their superpowers. The first tests of psychics showed that they do not possess anything like that. Were you present at the trials? What can you say? 

– I did not participate in this particular story, because I was not in Moscow. But everything seems to have turned out well there. The first two subjects were there. 

– Yes, I read that both participants failed the tests…

– But in general it's not very surprising. If the experiment is really carefully and properly set up, then, in fact, it gives the results that should have been expected, and which we have seen. This is what happens when there is no way to look into the eyes of the presenter and follow the direction of his gaze.

– That is, there is no way to cheat…

– I admit that these people really believe in their superpowers. But either they really expected such a show as on TV, or they could be sincerely mistaken about their abilities. But in any case, they were not afraid! I think there will be fewer people willing to do it now. 

– Don't you think that there is some kind of intimidation policy going on now? And strange bills help this…

– Firstly, I still try to speak out within my professional competence. I'm not a political scientist. As a simple citizen, I think that a lot of nonsense can be explained by different things. It is clear that there is illiteracy. Secondly, it seems to me that the constant creation of information noise is more significant. 

Clogging up the news with nonsense, so that God forbid the discussion of something meaningful does not begin; the political technological creation of a smoke screen. Instead of discussing whether it is necessary to send Russian contractors first to Donbass and then to Syria, we are discussing some kind of another bill of some kind of fool. It's just a switch of attention. But I'm just guessing. In this case, my reasoning is no better than yours. 

– There was a precedent the other day: I wrote a piece about religious rituals from a medical point of view. The believers themselves were interested in the safety of communion for health. Accordingly, I took a comment from the doctor. In the comments, they immediately began to say that I was walking on thin ice. Are we on the verge of religion becoming an inviolable topic even from the point of view of science?

– What to say: it doesn't surprise me. The ROC is now quite active in suppressing any critical statements against it. It can be anything: architecture, museum business, and so on.

– Well, as for museums. For the Arena, Enteo generally got off with some hefty ridiculous punishment.

– Well, there, if I understand correctly, a criminal case was opened after all. We'll see.

– Things are going great with the Dissernet. He does several examinations a day. I think there are four thousand of them published now. In this sense, everything works very well. A working contact has been established, albeit with some difficulties, with the Higher Attestation Commission, in any case, with some expert advice. There are precedents when quite influential people lost their degrees, although others, even more influential, did not lose them. In addition, the flow of outright hack work has decreased recently. 

– People realized that a dissertation can be not just a crust, but also a source of trouble and some reputational losses. This year it is already really clear that the "Dissernet" has influenced the mass consciousness.

"Dissernet" has caught many representatives of the state authorities in plagiarism. Among the latest sensational cases is the deprivation of the academic degree of the ex–chairman of the Moscow City Duma Vladimir Platonov.

– What have been the most high-profile cases of plagiarism recently? 

– I don't really like to refer to individual stories. The thing that upsets me the most about this is that there are a lot of people with fake dissertations among professors and even among university rectors. It's very sad. I don't understand how a teacher who copied his dissertation can forbid a student to write off his term paper.

The second thing that also upsets me very much is the nightmarish flow of lime trees in dissertations from doctors and law enforcement officers. That historians have rewritten the same thing once again is bad, but not fatal. Remember, there was such a not very appetizing children's joke about eggplant caviar, eaten three times. If historians have eaten some caviar three times – well, fuck them! But the fact that judges, teachers and doctors have fake dissertations is very dangerous. These are the three most painful points. 

Special cases – here you are, please!

Our rockets don't fly very well, and the rector of Baumanka's doctoral dissertation is pretty much written off, and Baumanka is the main technical university of the country. Is there a connection between these phenomena? I don't know. Maybe there is. Did you want a vivid example? Here he is! Not some regular deputy, but the rector of the country's most important technical university. 

– Don't you have an idea to write your own popular science book? 

– I really want to, yes. I have been planning for more than a year. Only there is no time yet. I'm very afraid that it won't work out.