Live to be 150 years old
Academician of the Russian Academy of Medical Sciences Vladimir Shabalin talks about pills against old age, home cancer prevention and technical immortality
Igor Yelkov, Rossiyskaya Gazeta – Week, 10.11.2011
In line for eternityRossiyskaya Gazeta: Vladimir Nikolaevich, a proposal was made in the State Duma to oblige drivers over 65 to renew their rights twice as often, that is, not once every 10 years, as now, but in 5 years.
Because the health and reaction speed of the elderly are no longer the same. You are just one of the largest medical luminaries in the field of gerontology, and in your writings you prove almost the opposite: a person's potential is fully revealed only by the age of 60-70. A contradiction?
Vladimir Shabalin: Absolutely. A person under the age of 75, according to the gradation of the World Health Organization, cannot be considered an old man. WHO officially considers this to be the border of old age. Senile on the WHO scale – from 75 to 90 years. Over 90 – longevity.
And for people not at all in old age, but simply in old age, they propose to introduce restrictions. Which, to put it mildly, is unreasonable, unreasonable and unfair. This is another example of age discrimination. I confirm: intellectual potential is fully revealed only by the age of 60-70, but even after this age, intellectual development does not end. A person in his 60s and 70s is active, literate, and behaves more decently in a social environment than young people. As for emergency situations on the roads, then, according to expert data, the elderly get into them much less often than the young.
Yes, the factors of aging cannot be ignored, and by the age of 60-70, the intensity of accumulation of "intellectual material" in the human brain slows down. But a person at this age is able to actively use the accumulated material, and the vast majority does it quite successfully, not counting themselves as old people. Suffice it to say that more than half of scientific discoveries and masterpieces of art were created by the elderly.
RG: Pharmacists today offer geroprotectors – drugs that are declared a medicine that allows you to prolong youth or slow down the onset of old age. Are they effective?
Shabalin: Not a single medicine, not a single dietary supplement, including thousands of types of widely advertised geroprotectors, have not prolonged anyone's life and rejuvenated anyone yet. These are myths actively exaggerated by interested parties. Yes, advertising of geroprotectors sounds on every corner, as well as many other medications, but there is no elixir of youth. It has not been created.
RG: Many readers were hoping for a completely different answer.
Shabalin: There is no scientifically substantiated evidence that any medical drug can slow down the physiological aging process. All these are idle fictions, the purpose of which is to extract financial benefits. I understand readers: even in professional medical circles, not many people understand what aging of the body is. And this is the most fundamental, most significant biological process in our life, which determines the evolutionary development of man and wildlife as a whole.
Yes, this process is realized by a person in a deeply tragic way. But after all, we do not experience emotional experiences due to the fact that billions of cells of our body die every day. Similarly, the biosphere, which is a single living organism, does not see a tragedy in the fact that billions of its elements – living organisms - die every day.
Our body lives only under the condition of aging and death of its elements – cells. Living matter lives and develops only because aging organisms die, pouring their outgoing life into the life of descendants. The great law of life: to live is to die. And there is no paradox in this.
RG: It is known that wealthy people in Russia privately finance the development of special medicines "against old age". They proceed from the theory that the body gives itself an order to age. And they are developing a drug that will paralyze such a team. Do you know anything about the results?
Shabalin: You probably mean "Jonah Skulachev", the project of Academician Vladimir Skulachev? So far, the result is zero. The authors failed to achieve what they had planned: neither in state laboratories nor in private ones.
RG: And this is despite the huge financial injections? Explain at a level accessible to the layman: what is so impossible about creating such a drug? The genome has been decoded, we are flying into space...
Shabalin: The fact is that the organization of our body is many times more complicated than anything created by the intellect of mankind. So, the protein molecule, the basic element of our life, is a very complex probe, with the complexity of the structure and functionality of which our highest achievements – spacecraft – cannot be compared. One microscopic molecule is much more complex than a space satellite. And we have 10 such molecules to the 31st degree, and each of them has a biological individuality. All protein molecules are in continuous motion, it's some kind of crazy dance. Each of them is in constant search of adequate structures corresponding to changes in the factors surrounding it. Which, in fact, is the mechanism of evolutionary development.
Intercellular relationships and intermolecular connections in our body are much more complex things than spacecraft connections. Actually, this is the answer to your question: the system is too complex, and therefore one cannot expect that any single drug can change the whole range of diverse, high-speed, constantly changing biological movements that make up our life. The huge flywheel of our life, untwisted for billions of years by all our numerous predecessors – biological species and individuals – cannot be stopped or slowed down by pills, elixirs, or ions.
And you shouldn't do it – her Majesty's Life is going on! I appeal to all people: help her movement with your rational lifestyle, I appeal to scientists: direct your intellectual forces to develop ways and means that prevent the development of pathological forms of aging and contribute to the preservation of physiological forms of aging.
It is important to remember that the supreme commander of our life is the psyche. No pills, products will change anything if a person does not have internal motivation for longevity.
Without a miracleRG: How long can a person live without miracle drugs?
Shabalin: Expert assessment: 120-150 years, in any case, genetic programs provide such an opportunity. But how do we implement them? One burns down by the age of 40, the second becomes a long-liver. And everyone has their own genetic program: for someone it measures only 20 years of life, and for someone it is all 120. And besides, our genetic program is being implemented under the pressure of a lot of environmental factors, which in total have a negative impact on it.
RG: And where or how can I find out my genetic pathologies and the biological resource of life?
Shabalin: You can't find out your genetic program. The human genome has been deciphered only in quantitative terms, its quality continues to remain a mystery. What do we know? A person has 30-35 thousand genes. Of these, the function of only a few hundred is known, the rest is still an unknown area.
Of course, there is a group of pronounced genetic disorders that are well diagnosed, and the doctor can give recommendations: what to watch out for, what kind of lifestyle to lead, in some cases it can help to correct pathological abnormalities. But in general, no one will tell a healthy person today how long his genes "prescribe" to live, what quality of life awaits him ahead.
RG: And when will they say?
Shabalin: According to forecasts, sometime in the middle of this century.
RG: Let's assume the best: my genes allow me to live 100 years. What should I do to implement this program to the maximum? Do not drink, do not smoke, do physical education?
Shabalin: Yes, of course, get rid of bad habits. But let's first separate the factors that depend on our will from the independent ones. The environment, which is constantly changing, does not depend on the individual.
But a lot depends! Nutrition: look, our products contain GMOs, chemical additives. In fact, the state has withdrawn from food control, the composition is simply indicated on the products. Watch, think and decide.
Do not overload yourself with food. Today, for many, this has become a serious problem: we consume more food than we expend energy. At the same time, we strive to lose weight with the help of chemical additives – a factor that accelerates the aging process.
RG: So you need to remember about starvation diets?
Shabalin: You need to consume adequate amounts of food with an appropriate energy component, which should meet the needs of your body, its energy expenditure indicators.
Next: keep track of the balance of vegetable and animal fats. There is enough popular literature on this topic, do not be lazy, study. A person does not need any exotic diets. As well as fasting, especially long ones. I am against mono-diets, because the human body has consumed certain foods for hundreds of thousands of years, it is adapted to them. A person, figuratively speaking, consists of a million different components, and therefore limiting oneself to mono-diets means depriving the body of substances necessary for its optimal existence.
RG: What about alcohol? It is believed that a glass of red wine can neutralize the notorious free radicals that damage cells, accelerate the aging of the heart and blood vessels. And almost saves you from cancer.
Shabalin: Alcohol is a tricky and ambiguous thing. Everything is very individual. One can take a glass of wine, not necessarily red, by the way. Another is contraindicated. Consult with doctors, monitor your own feelings. If after a glass of wine in the morning you get up not very cheerful, perhaps the liver is not coping. Alcohol abuse is dangerous, and not only strong, but also weak. Such a form of pathology as beer alcoholism is well known.
RG: On Victory Day, veterans are traditionally offered "combat 100 grams". Veterans over 80, is alcohol dangerous at their age?
Shabalin: If once a year a person who is over 80 drinks 100 grams, then a general festive psychological uplift and a friendly atmosphere will help him cope with this dose. But I repeat: alcohol tolerance is individual, it is better not to take risks.
RG: And what do you say about being overweight? The data of scientists are contradictory, the results of research by American doctors have recently been published, who claim that those who have 7-8 extra kilograms live longer than their thinner or fuller fellow citizens.
Shabalin: An extra 7-8 kilograms is moderate obesity, it has a protective effect in some life situations and is more favorable than exhaustion. But obvious overweight, say, obesity of the 3rd degree, of course, is a negative factor in all respects.
RG: What else? Right on the points.
Shabalin: Let's go through the points.
Sleep is a very important component of our life. Hardening is a necessary element of stimulating our biological activity, and not only because it forms protection against colds. Hardening directly affects the immune system. And the immune system protects the body not only against infections, but also against many other pathological conditions, including oncogenic ones. After all, billions of cells in our body undergo malignant deformation every day, and they need to be destroyed quickly and effectively. Otherwise, the immune system is weakened, and these cells create their own "malicious state" – a cancerous tumor.
Physical and intellectual activity are mandatory. As a car rusts without moving, so the liver, lungs, heart and intellect of a person quickly degrade, lose their activity – the so-called atrophy from inactivity. If you have been engaged in intellectual work all your life, and after retirement you neglect it, then you doom yourself to a faster functional destruction of the brain. A person is programmed to work.
And you need to control your emotions, do not shoot "from an adrenaline cannon at sparrows": if someone pushed us in public transport, you should not burst into a storm of emotions in response. With such emotionality, a person is unlikely to become a long-lived person. Learn to defuse even complex problems with a joke, treat dramas philosophically.
Stay aliveRG: In the USA, a famous computer scientist announced that in 2045 science will allow you to live indefinitely.
A movement named after this date has been created in Russia. Are you probably skeptical?
Shabalin: Well, why not. On the contrary, I am a member of the Russia-2045 movement, and an active one.
RG: But wasn't it Academician Shabalin who warned us that the eternal life of homo sapiens would be a catastrophe for humanity?
Shabalin: Our organs do not age at the same time, the heart may wear out, and the brain will be preserved. And on the contrary, a person is somatically healthy, carries logs, and the intellect is ruined. Therefore, the destroyed and worn out somatic elements can be replaced, prolonging the life of a valuable person. The project, I note, does not provide immortality to all mankind. In addition, I am not in favor of replacing the elements of our brain with electronic components, even if this becomes possible by 2045, it will mean the loss of personality. And in general, it is unlikely to contribute to the preservation of humanity as a biological species. Another thing is an artificial body.
RG: But still: is it possible to replace worn-out organs and the whole body by 2045?
Shabalin: In principle, yes. However, this project has not yet been funded. But if you organize research, then something will work out.
RG: Sorry for the pragmatism, but let's count. 33 years and 2 months separate us from 2045. This newspaper is now held in the hands of more than three and a half million people. Can you imagine how many of them are now mentally adding 33 years to their age, and... Someone sighs heavily, and someone, on the contrary, straightens his shoulders. It's possible to make it! And then the fairy tale: we change the worn-out body and live, live.
Shabalin: First of all, it will not be a kind of rubicon: in 2044 there is nothing, and in 2045 the alley of new life opens. A lot has already been done to replace individual human organs and tissues. Well, after 2045... It is unlikely that we will totally replace all the bodies – on a huge conveyor to transplant the heads on electronic somatic machines. According to many experts, in the second half of this century, the human population on Earth will reach 12 billion, and this is the maximum that our planet is able to withstand. It is necessary to preserve the living space for normal people, to leave a minimum for cyborgs.
There is a second aspect. By working on this project, we can discover something valuable for humanity. Dreams of rejuvenation did not arise today.
In the 1920s, revolutionary Alexander Bogdanov proposed a way to prolong life by transfusing the blood of young people to the elderly. At the end of 1925, Stalin ordered Bogdanov to create the world's first Blood Transfusion Institute, for which he allocated the mansion of merchant Igumnov on Bolshaya Yakimanka.
What is the result? It was not possible to rejuvenate the country, but what a development transfusiology has received! How many thousands of lives she saved, especially during the war.
Look what happened: the project was aimed at one thing, but it was created completely different. This often happens in science. So if Russia-2045 unites the interests of physicians, biologists, mechanics, technologists, fundamental scientists, etc., then something interesting may turn out. Although, I repeat, I personally do not think that we will put the creation of artificial bodies on stream. Perhaps only the most valuable brain for humanity will be able to prolong life in an artificial body.
Who will choose the most valuable – the question is not for me. The main thing is that we can get important scientific achievements.
Dossier "RG"
The director of the Scientific and Clinical Center of Gerontology, Academician Shabalin Vladimir Nikolaevich.
He was born in 1939 in the Altai Territory. After graduating from the Medical Institute, he worked in a district hospital in the Magadan region, then at the Leningrad Research Institute of Hematology in various positions. Further positions in the Ministry of Health of the RSFSR and the Russian Federation, up to the Deputy Minister of the Russian Federation.
He does not smoke, alcohol is only "on occasion" and very rarely. Sleeps 6-7 hours, works constantly, including weekends.
About physical education: "Sometimes I run, ride a bicycle in the country. Exercise – every morning, I pour cold water on myself."
About its menu: "A variety of natural food. I'm gradually giving up animal fats."
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10.11.2011